Special Operations Group

Might I suggest that deaths be rolled back as well, perhaps at the rate of 1 per hour (do your own math to come up with a number you like) as far as calculations go. It seems that playing for an hour and not dying would be a pretty great feat since it seems that, of those that play, we all seem to die at least once every 30 minutes (more if the server is empty when we play), but those deaths accumulate and can never be reduced. My point is that often the deaths are just as glitched as the game penalty system. It only seems fair that some of those deaths can drop off with time played as well.

Also, if you apply a simply eye test to the level of game play you see from let's say Columbo. He rarely gets shot and makes nearly perfect shoot/no shoot decisions, yet his score is 41%. This means the ranking / scoring would not pass the eye test of determining the quality of gaming from the individual. This means that players using lethal weapons and making great decisions about shooting or not shooting can never hope to rank high. The quality of game play should have a factor to the overall score in some way. I can go into the server using non lethal all the time and never get a penalty....ever. For me, that would not be exciting. For the game to be exciting for me, I must give the armed suspect an opportunity to comply and then, based upon his reaction, apply appropriate force to control the situation without getting myself or anyone else killed. I will never score higher than 0% on your ranking system, but I'm a skilled player that completes about 60% of missions even when playing alone, makes solid shoot/no shoot decisions (suspect arrest to incapacitation rate of about 4/1), and put my shots on target an overwhelming percentage of the time. According to SOG scoring, that's worth nothing. 0%.

[quote=""SAS_Random""]Might I suggest that deaths be rolled back as well, perhaps at the rate of 1 per hour (do your own math to come up with a number you like) as far as calculations go. It seems that playing for an hour and not dying would be a pretty great feat since it seems that, of those that play, we all seem to die at least once every 30 minutes (more if the server is empty when we play), but those deaths accumulate and can never be reduced. My point is that often the deaths are just as glitched as the game penalty system. It only seems fair that some of those deaths can drop off with time played as well.

Also, if you apply a simply eye test to the level of game play you see from let's say Columbo. He rarely gets shot and makes nearly perfect shoot/no shoot decisions, yet his score is 41%. This means the ranking / scoring would not pass the eye test of determining the quality of gaming from the individual. This means that players using lethal weapons and making great decisions about shooting or not shooting can never hope to rank high. The quality of game play should have a factor to the overall score in some way. I can go into the server using non lethal all the time and never get a penalty....ever. For me, that would not be exciting. For the game to be exciting for me, I must give the armed suspect an opportunity to comply and then, based upon his reaction, apply appropriate force to control the situation without getting myself or anyone else killed. I will never score higher than 0% on your ranking system, but I'm a skilled player that completes about 60% of missions even when playing alone, makes solid shoot/no shoot decisions (suspect arrest to incapacitation rate of about 4/1), and put my shots on target an overwhelming percentage of the time. According to SOG scoring, that's worth nothing. 0%.[/quote]


The rank system is in its beta version. I offered my help and I will try to figure out a new equation that will be giving the final score to the leaderboard. For now, the system was resetted to give us some fresh data (free of those penalties given by Jessica before she started deducting 4 penalties per 20 minutes). According to this data, a new equation will be developed to make this rank system greater again I think Matt can confirm what I wrote above when he’s online When this is finished, players will be happier than ever before!

Edit: I didn’t see Matt’s previous post... that’s mainly what I meant

PS: It seems like real policemen use the guns too early comparing to the RoE used in game This is probably something for game programmers than Jessica’s standards anyway... Probably in real life you don’t wait until they are close to shoot you because of the danger of penalties...

Suggest calculate stats for week or maybe month then reset them to 0 ( If possible keep hours independent )
Example:
Played 80h, killed 7 hostages, 3 deaths bla bla % score

stats resets
Played 40h, killed 2 hostages, 1death bla bla % score ( calculated with 40h but over all 120h )

i think resseting the death count is not needed as it will be minimum and doesn't have much impact like the penaltys, it will be minimum depending on the hours anyway.

Maybe just make the death penaltys count for 20% only and then time and penalty 40% each, like that.

that will make your rank go higher, if you just want to let the death penalty go donw because you don't wanna show how many times you die.

imo if it doesn't affect jess just let it stay, penaltys affect how jess react ingame, deaths not.

Update: automaticly reset is also not needed as that will reset the muppets too, maybe a button where you can request that needs to be aproved.

[quote=""Ninwes""]i think resseting the death count is not needed as it will be minimum and doesn't have much impact like the penaltys, it will be minimum depending on the hours anyway.[/quote]

Its still counts together with penalties and that percentage you get

[quote=""Ninwes""]that will make your rank go higher, if you just want to let the death penalty go donw because you don't wanna show how many times you die.[/quote]


I do want to see deaths and penalties as it motivates you to be better and learn on misstakes. The point of me willing to reset stats as to show each time period how good you are and keep the leaderboard dynamic each time period. What will be interesting and entertaining as there is some challenge. As not everyone have much time to waste in games so not many chances to be in leaderboard . But if stats will reset you can attend in fight for some places at this week period and then have busy next week without chances to play. Also it will eliminate problem with players in leaderboard who reached rank and then stopped playing but keep place occupied

Could keep all the stats also in profile ( overall hours/time/penalties )


[quote=""Ninwes""]Update: automaticly reset is also not needed as that will reset the muppets too, maybe a button where you can request that needs to be aproved.[/quote]

What are the 'muppets'? Not sure I understand it or how complicated it to code that

example 1: a player takes 15 minutes to clear a map and plays 4 maps like that and he dies one time. No penalties and 1 death.

example 2: a player takes 7.5 minutes per map x 8 maps and dies 2 times over the same duration of time. That player scores lower because 2 deaths is more than 1 death.

Anyone that doesn't see that as unfairly weighted should speak up and explain your perspective.

If it's possible to track missions played so that time is not the sole denominator-- Even something as simple as (penalties + deaths) / rounds before factoring in the time played would be better.

100-(Penalties+Deaths)/Rounds/Hours*100


It would fix the inequities against those with a faster pace of play. Time as the sole denominator is crushing that type of player's score.

[quote=""SAS_Random""]example 1: a player takes 15 minutes to clear a map and plays 4 maps like that and he dies one time. No penalties and 1 death.

example 2: a player takes 7.5 minutes per map x 8 maps and dies 2 times over the same duration of time. That player scores lower because 2 deaths is more than 1 death.[/quote]


For me, more pro would be the first one. They both die 1 time per 4 maps, but at least the first one does it more tactically, slower and uses their brain more often

The first might have been killed as a result of a bugged sus not aiming at him before shot.

Excluding tournament purposes of getting as short time as possible to clear the map, I can honesty admin doing a map in time less than 8 minutes or on some maps less than 13-15 minutes is just a rush-gameplay - spotted often in rambos...

[quote=""KeeRIeS""]For me, more pro would be the first one. They both die 1 time per 4 maps, but at least the first one does it more tactically, slower and uses their brain more often

The first might have been killed as a result of a bugged sus not aiming at him before shot.

Excluding tournament purposes of getting as short time as possible to clear the map, I can honesty admin doing a map in time less than 8 minutes or on some maps less than 13-15 minutes is just a rush-gameplay - spotted often in rambos...[/quote]

You are incorrect here. The faster you clear the better. All special forces training to clear building as fast as possible. First you training your stress resistance and how fast you can think in such situations. Also you adapt faster when situation is changed. Time is life as they say

[quote=""Orion""]What are the 'muppets'? Not sure I understand it or how complicated it to code that[/quote]

The people who come in server and just shoot everyone, or kill civs, and so on, those muppets.

Like i said a button where you can ask for a reset that then needs to be aproved eliminates the reset of the rule breakers where no admin is there.

[quote=""SAS_Random""]example 1: a player takes 15 minutes to clear a map and plays 4 maps like that and he dies one time. No penalties and 1 death.

example 2: a player takes 7.5 minutes per map x 8 maps and dies 2 times over the same duration of time. That player scores lower because 2 deaths is more than 1 death.

Anyone that doesn't see that as unfairly weighted should speak up and explain your perspective.

If it's possible to track missions played so that time is not the sole denominator-- Even something as simple as (penalties + deaths) / rounds before factoring in the time played would be better.

100-(Penalties+Deaths)/Rounds/Hours*100


It would fix the inequities against those with a faster pace of play. Time as the sole denominator is crushing that type of player's score.[/quote]

Yes could be fixed with a quotation where deaths are only counted for 10% or so:

For example with every 5 hours played 1 death is allowed, then the qoutation of penaltys that still make the score good.

Hey, wanted to give some feedback about the ranking formula

As it is now, I find it way too punishing and biased towards non-lethal playstyle.

While the latter is of course a decision SOG has to make (reward use of non-lethal weapons), it is still almost impossible to get a decent score (>50%) even for Non-lethal players IN THE LONG TERM.
I just took the formula from post #5 Matt did.
Even if you die ONCE in 2 hours (!) of gameplay, you get maximum of 50%. Even if doing 0 penalties.
Example: 100%-((90D + 15P) / (186hrs)*100=43,5%
I find this a very ambitious aim, especially in public gameplay

Another problem i see is, there is only the mistakes of players taken into account. Like Random said, that a person played more rounds and have therefore made more ARRESTS (or legal kills) is not counted.

Sorry but i also cannot agree to the philosophy "slow gameplay = tactical gameplay". That is simply not true!
First of all the term "tactic" has no relation to time, it is an: "action or strategy carefully planned to achieve a specific end" (Oxford dictionary).
Thus, you can very well perform a tactic fast, with teamwork, stacking properly, performing mirror/scans etc. So this attitude does not comprise the whole issue appropriately.

After all, i think the system, how it is now, is not very motivating for players in general. I mean look at the leaderboard (http://www.sog-team.co.uk/report/statistics.php), a experienced and skilled player like Random, getting a 10-15% score? Keeries with 1 hour gameplay getting 56%?
Idk... again i like the idea behind an evaluation/ranking system... but this needs more tweaking

Greetings